Unions in Michigan

I believe people should display their beliefs. All who oppose the right to self defense and the right to own a gun should display a "Gun Free" symbol on their person, their home and business. This way the criminals will know where to go to practice their trade safely and I will know where not to go.
 
sailsmen said:
The right to self defense and the right to own a hand gun is not a requirement to self defense or to own a hand gun.
You still have the right to do nothing and to watch your self, your friends and family be slaughtered. You don't have the right to require the same of me.
Hand guns are used everyday in the USA to defend and protect from violence.
Of the 4 people I know who were murdered and the 14 women who were rapped including home invasion and torture none were engaged in criminal activity and all were unarmed.
Try walking around and driving around with a shot gun in your hand. Very, very difficult. A hand gun is for self defense and long gun is for killing.

CATO - "That means tens of thousands of crimes are prevented each year by ordinary citizens with guns." http://www.cato.org/publications/wh...when-criminals-face-armed-resistance-citizens

Dr. Kleck "Our results ended up indicating, depending on which figures you prefer to use, anywhere from 800,000 on up to 2.4, 2.5 million defensive uses of guns against human beings -- not against animals -- by civilians each year." http://rense.com/general76/univ.htm
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LA might be the most armed place in the world, must have a very low crime rate.
 
Gun owners are victims of crimes everyday, owning a gun will not necessarily prevent you from bring a victim
All it takes for evil to succeed is the determination
Lets not forget, Gabby Gifford, Columbine, Virginia Tech, the mall shooting, the Colorado shooting and yesterday's tragedy all happened with legally owned and registered weapons of either the shooters themselves or relatives of the shooter

In short nobody is going to take away your goddamn guns, it will never happen as it has been tried and failed miserably

However if you are a law abiding citizen with nothing to hide, why a does an extensive background check, mental facilities test, and extensive training requirement translate into we are taking your guns

It should be more ****ing difficult to get a gun than ordering fries at McDonalds

Evil will happen everyday, it will always find a way. I've heard the guns don't kill people crap, they do. And because they are a lethal weapon, you should be required to do a hell of a lot more than go through a 3 day waiting period.

We have all seen the numerous idiots walking around every day doing stupid things, stupid people do stupid things. Now let a stupid person buy a gun.

In short you can't prevent this from happening, but to think because you own a gun you'll be able to Rambo up in the face of danger when confronted, most people freeze.

Because I know your going to google your rebuttal, you can save me the time, I'm willing to bet more people are injured by their own guns, as opposed to being All Die Hard and actually shooting the criminal

Training and deep background checks are what's needed, not banning guns


The Ice Bucket Approves of this message
 
That I believe is Texas!! Try robbing a store there and I believe they still have the death penalty there also. If the ahole yesterday drove his car around a play ground running over kids and killing them would we ban cars?
 
nh muscle said:
That I believe is Texas!! Try robbing a store there and I believe they still have the death penalty there also. If the ahole yesterday drove his car around a play ground running over kids and killing them would we ban cars?
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No, but we do require training to get a license, testing that is renewed. Comparing a car to a gun I don't think is a valid comparison.

And to be fair, I don't believe anyone here has said ban guns, in fact I don't believe any government official has ever said ban guns.

Shouldn't they be harder to get than a fishing license?

A gun is called a lethal weapon for a reason.


The Ice Bucket Approves of this message
 
Starting to sound like the legal forum on 1911.org. Gun laws and CCW are different state to state. Where in NYS it is a lengthy process, as much as a year, where I am moving it involves a 8hr class and a NICS check. Quite a difference.

I certainly agree with training. I had hundreds of hours. 2+ years after retiring I continue to train on a regular basis to keep my skills up. If I was loon though, well thats protected information...
 
sailsmen said:
The right to self defense and the right to own a hand gun is not a requirement to self defense or to own a hand gun.
You still have the right to do nothing and to watch your self, your friends and family be slaughtered. You don't have the right to require the same of me.
Hand guns are used everyday in the USA to defend and protect from violence.
Of the 4 people I know who were murdered and the 14 women who were rapped including home invasion and torture none were engaged in criminal activity and all were unarmed.
Try walking around and driving around with a shot gun in your hand. Very, very difficult. A hand gun is for self defense and long gun is for killing.

CATO - "That means tens of thousands of crimes are prevented each year by ordinary citizens with guns." http://www.cato.org/publications/wh...when-criminals-face-armed-resistance-citizens

Dr. Kleck "Our results ended up indicating, depending on which figures you prefer to use, anywhere from 800,000 on up to 2.4, 2.5 million defensive uses of guns against human beings -- not against animals -- by civilians each year." http://rense.com/general76/univ.htm
Click to expand...
http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/30/opinion/frum-guns-safer/index.html?c=&page=1




The Ice Bucket Approves of this message
 
cat in the hat said:
Where the hell do you live ? !
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You just don't get it!

All of these victims did not have a gun within reach, if everyone in LA had guns within 4 feet of them there would be zero crime in LA.

I will save you the trouble of posting this sailsmen, everyone come to kernies house, he is unarmed!

:D
 
kernie said:
You just don't get it!

All of these victims did not have a gun within reach, if everyone in LA had guns within 4 feet of them there would be zero crime in LA.

I will save you the trouble of posting this sailsmen, everyone come to kernies house, he is unarmed!

:D
Click to expand...

Kernieville Marauder meet. Buffalo Wings, blue cheese, beer, soda, hockey on tv and our Marauder friends FTW


Sent from my iPhone 4S

DTR + 4.10's + Eaton swap = Wreeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom
 
Myths about the Middle Class? Do the facts paint a different picture?
What the facts below tell us is 1) that 60% of the population in the middle incomes in real dollars grew 40% from 1979-2007.

2) that the Top 1% income is "quite volatile" and 3) from 2007-10 retirees and people on welfare were the only group whose income rose.



The 60% of the population in the middle income is stable and in real dollars has grown from 1979 to 2010 by ~28%. This indicates this group is dominated by non risk takers, people who are employees and people who work for the Gov't.



The Top 1% of the populations income in real dollars has grown from 1980 to 2009 by ~67%. This group is dominated by risk takers.



Should people who take risk by 1) starting and then selling a business or 2) by buying and selling a business or 3) by buying and selling stocks have a greater reward than people who do not take risk?



"Between 2007 and 2009, after-tax earnings by Americans in the top one percent for income fell 37 percent."



Per the Federal Reserve between 2007-10 "...while the median real income fell 7.7% and retirees and non-workers incomes rose"!


"The Fed survey found that the median value of family income, when adjusted for inflation and before taxes, fell by 7.7 percent — from $49,600 in 2007 to $45,800 in 2010. The median is the midpoint of all family income."

"The decline in median income was widespread across demographic groups, with only a few groups experiencing stable or rising incomes," the Fed survey said. "Most noticeably, median incomes moved higher for retirees and other nonworking families. The decline in median income was most pronounced among more highly educated families … and families living in the South and West regions."



The Fed found that median net worth fell 38.9 percent — from $126,400 in 2007 to $77,300 in 2010.



Per the CBO from 1979, (a stock market low), until 2007, (a stock market high), the Top 1% increased 275%. Using 1980 until 2008 it would be 165%.



“ For the 60 percent of the population in the middle of the income scale (the 21st through 80th percentiles), the growth in average real after-taxhousehold income was just under 40 percent.”



“Average real after-tax income for that group, top 1%, has been quite volatile: It spiked in1986 and fell in 1987, reflecting an acceleration of capital gains realizations into 1986 in anticipation of the scheduled increase in tax rates the following year. Income growth for the top 1 percent of the population rebounded in 1988 but fell again with the onset of the 1990–1991 recession. By 1994, after-tax householdincome was 50 percent higher than it had been in 1979. Income growth surged in1995, averaging more than 11 percent per year through 2000. After falling sharply in 2001 because of the recession and stock market drop, average realafter-tax income for the top 1 percent of the population rose by more than 85 percent

between2002 and 2007. (The turmoil in financial markets in 2008 probably reversed someof that growth, but it is not clear by how much or forhow long.)”

“…capital gains, accounted about four-fifths of the total increase in concentration..”
 
sailsmen said:
Myths about the Middle Class? Do the facts paint a different picture?
What the facts below tell us is 1) that 60% of the population in the middle incomes in real dollars grew 40% from 1979-2007.

2) that the Top 1% income is "quite volatile" and 3) from 2007-10 retirees and people on welfare were the only group whose income rose.



The 60% of the population in the middle income is stable and in real dollars has grown from 1979 to 2010 by ~28%. This indicates this group is dominated by non risk takers, people who are employees and people who work for the Gov't.



The Top 1% of the populations income in real dollars has grown from 1980 to 2009 by ~67%. This group is dominated by risk takers.



Should people who take risk by 1) starting and then selling a business or 2) by buying and selling a business or 3) by buying and selling stocks have a greater reward than people who do not take risk?



"Between 2007 and 2009, after-tax earnings by Americans in the top one percent for income fell 37 percent."



Per the Federal Reserve between 2007-10 "...while the median real income fell 7.7% and retirees and non-workers incomes rose"!


"The Fed survey found that the median value of family income, when adjusted for inflation and before taxes, fell by 7.7 percent — from $49,600 in 2007 to $45,800 in 2010. The median is the midpoint of all family income."

"The decline in median income was widespread across demographic groups, with only a few groups experiencing stable or rising incomes," the Fed survey said. "Most noticeably, median incomes moved higher for retirees and other nonworking families. The decline in median income was most pronounced among more highly educated families … and families living in the South and West regions."



The Fed found that median net worth fell 38.9 percent — from $126,400 in 2007 to $77,300 in 2010.



Per the CBO from 1979, (a stock market low), until 2007, (a stock market high), the Top 1% increased 275%. Using 1980 until 2008 it would be 165%.





“…capital gains, accounted about four-fifths of the total increase in concentration..”
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Dude, instead of copy and pasting, how about you just post the links, it will probably save a tremendous amount of space on the server

And your latest isn't even in relation to the original topic-unions, or the secondary topic-guns.

Are you just surfing the websites to find random stuff to post?




The Ice Bucket Approves of this message
 
cat in the hat said:
And you know them all personally ?
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Yes, I knew and know them. Not all in the Biblical sense.

A home invasion resulted in her being ganged rapped and he being beaten. She was 6 months pregnant and still a newlywed. The motive was robbery. The police eventually caught them. I dined at their house many a times and attended their wedding.

When I was 12 I awoke to my father stopping a drug crazed burglar breaking into our house with his M1 Carbine and the words stop or I will shoot. My father held him at gun point until the police arrived.
 
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So the middle class is doing just fine?

I don't buy it.

If you are middle class, can you say that your wages/income have kept up with prices?
 
In New Orleans many of the middle to upper middle class neighborhoods hire a private police detail at nite to meet you at your home to guard you getting in. These were not HO Assns just people forming a purchasing group.
Upper class have full time private police details.
Some areas have formed a separate taxing district specifically for additional police protection.
 
sailsmen said:
In New Orleans many of the middle to upper middle class neighborhoods hire a private police detail at nite to meet you at your home to guard you getting in. These were not HO Assns just people forming a purchasing group.
Upper class have full time private police details.
Some areas have formed a separate taxing district specifically for additional police protection.
Click to expand...

Uhm, if I had to resort to that, I'd move as fast as my feet could carry me. If you can not be safe in your own home, whats the point in living in that town?
 
guspech750 said:
Kernieville Marauder meet. Buffalo Wings, blue cheese, beer, soda, hockey on tv and our Marauder friends FTW


Sent from my iPhone 4S

DTR + 4.10's + Eaton swap = Wreeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom
Click to expand...

My bid won marauderville!

Wow, i really thought Atlanta was going to win!

Wait till all my neighbors see all those MM's pull up! Nice cars they will say...wait...they are Americans!!!

Back inside! I bet they will even lock their doors!









:D
 
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