B
Bacque
Guest
My car seems to start fast, the motor revs up to 2500rpm, seems without oil pressure this would be harmful to the engine, any comments?
MAD-3R
"Revenant"
Welcome Bacque!!!
Ok, to rephrase, when you motor starts, it jumps to 2500 RPMs, and then settles back down, and sence no oil is flowing for that jump, is it bad.
I really can not offer a knowledgeable opinion. Others here can, and will, and at great length, wether you want them to or not.
:lol:
Ok, to rephrase, when you motor starts, it jumps to 2500 RPMs, and then settles back down, and sence no oil is flowing for that jump, is it bad.
I really can not offer a knowledgeable opinion. Others here can, and will, and at great length, wether you want them to or not.
:lol:
the fat bastid
Kneel before Zod!
i've heard that the car does that on purpose to heat up the engine a bit. thats all i know....where is a wrench tech when ya need one?
Fourth Horseman
FSTMERC
I read once that the engine control system in newer cars are programmed to this on purpose. The theory being that the quicker you get the engine up to temperature the less wear is done. Allowing your car to idle at low RPM for a minute or two after starting and before driving is said to actually be worse than the quick, mid-RPM start.
Don't know this for a fact, this is just what I've read.
Don't know this for a fact, this is just what I've read.
M
MMManic
Guest
Mine revs up past 2500 too and I know it can't be good for my engine's longevity because it only gets driven on weekends. When I start it Saturday morning after every drop of oil is in the pan since the previous Saturday, I get two seconds worth of teeth-gritting rod knocks. Nobody seems to know how to correct the instant rev. My only solution so far is to run it one or two times during the week just so I don't have to hear the rod knock.
T
TripleTransAm
Guest
2500 RPM is damned high for a start up... even my Hondas have never started this high, carbed OR fuel injected!
I'm surprised NOBODY can track this down! I'm not familiar with Ford's EEC communications dump through the ALDL connector (yet, hardware coming soon), but it shouldn't be too hard to connect to the computer and see what RPM it's commanding. If it's not asking for such a high RPM, the problem is elsewhere... if it IS coming from the PCM, then something somewhere is giving the PCM a fit. Could even be some sort of idle air bypass being out of adjustment or something.
Does anyone know for sure if "desired idle speed" is a loggable piece of info on our PCMs? I'm considering the Autotap hardware/software combo (www. autotap.com, I believe).
I'm surprised NOBODY can track this down! I'm not familiar with Ford's EEC communications dump through the ALDL connector (yet, hardware coming soon), but it shouldn't be too hard to connect to the computer and see what RPM it's commanding. If it's not asking for such a high RPM, the problem is elsewhere... if it IS coming from the PCM, then something somewhere is giving the PCM a fit. Could even be some sort of idle air bypass being out of adjustment or something.
Does anyone know for sure if "desired idle speed" is a loggable piece of info on our PCMs? I'm considering the Autotap hardware/software combo (www. autotap.com, I believe).
SergntMac
Shelby GT X2--Back In Black
Well, I know y'all will not agree with me so flame away, but I pursued this over a year ago, and for the same reasons mentioned here. I'm just not comfortable with it. That aside, it even caused an argument with with a lady friend once because she thought I was showing off, which didn't get dropped until I stood outside the car while starting it! Jeeze...
I got just so far up the LM design ladder, to the point where a dozen voice mails were never returned. All along that climb, all I heard was "it occurs by design," "that's the way it is," and "it will take 100K miles to make any difference." Reasoning even reached back to engine oil weights being a factor and I wanted to hang up on the guy! (You didn't hear me say that now, I've had enough of the oil wars, K!)
So..."That's the way it is" and I give up. I'm going to save my worry beads for something else, like where I am going to get 93 octane gasoline in two years without buying it in a bottle. Y'all can chase this down all you want, but I really don't think LM is going to give us a straight answer, because I don't think they know one.
Can't help wondering one thing though...Way back a long time ago, I used to pump the throttle once or twice before hitting the ignition switch, and then I would tickle it one more time after ignition, causing the same engine response. Everyone did, some still do.
Could it be that some smartazzed kid designer said "hey, let's give 'em a 60's start up, you know...woooofff?"
Ya think?
I got just so far up the LM design ladder, to the point where a dozen voice mails were never returned. All along that climb, all I heard was "it occurs by design," "that's the way it is," and "it will take 100K miles to make any difference." Reasoning even reached back to engine oil weights being a factor and I wanted to hang up on the guy! (You didn't hear me say that now, I've had enough of the oil wars, K!)
So..."That's the way it is" and I give up. I'm going to save my worry beads for something else, like where I am going to get 93 octane gasoline in two years without buying it in a bottle. Y'all can chase this down all you want, but I really don't think LM is going to give us a straight answer, because I don't think they know one.
Can't help wondering one thing though...Way back a long time ago, I used to pump the throttle once or twice before hitting the ignition switch, and then I would tickle it one more time after ignition, causing the same engine response. Everyone did, some still do.
Could it be that some smartazzed kid designer said "hey, let's give 'em a 60's start up, you know...woooofff?"
Ya think?
jgc61sr2002
Contributing Member
Bacque - Welcome to the MM site. As others have stated the MM is designed that way. Enjoy your new ride.:up:
LincMercLover
Off duty.
I've never had mine tip that high. She goes up to about 1900-2000 on start-up, sometimes to about 1600 if you let the starter wind out (I try not to do that though, bad on the starter.). Mines an origanal build with the FDH2 computer that's supposively been updated. I run Mobil1 full synthetic 5W30, and will be switching to Royal Purple full synthetic 5W30 next change (if this all makes a difference). I would like to see new and old car start up next to each other and see if there's a difference. Seems to me that this could be a "newer program" problem.
M
Mark McQuaide
Guest
The motor is putting out the most emmissions at start-up. Maybe the revs run up to warm up the cats faster?
J
jrzygrl
Guest
Checked mine last night, only gets up to 1800 at start up. I personally like the REV at the start up, but, that's just me. My two sons wagged there finger at me a few times when I first got my car...until they realized it's supposed to do it.
Constable
North East Marauder Member
My father tore me a new a-hole the other night when i started the MM up in the driveway (3am). He said it actually woke him up because his windows were open. Then I got the "You're a friggin moron for revving your car when you start it up!". He refused to believe that the car just starts like that. Similar to SgtMac's scenario, i had to actually stand outside of the car while i turned the ignition in front of him. I don't think this issue is really going to lead to something huge. It's a modern engine. Logical ways of thinking don't apply on it.
metroplex
New Member
man... you marauder guys w/ tachs 
In my Crown Vic, I had Jerry program the chip for a higher idle RPM but it never jumps THAT high during initial startup. Maybe 1500-1800 RPM tops from the sound of it, then it drops to about 900 RPM and stays there.
On the 2003 E-250 w/ the 5.4, it almost sounds like its stalling out when idling compared to the Vic! It idles at 700RPM or so and is totally stock. My Vic gets the same gas mileage and is louder than the E-250.
Anyhow, if it just hits 2500 and dies down then you shouldn't worry too much. It's probably just working the oil pump to shoot the engine oil up into the valvetrain area faster.
Remember to use a quality synthetic and you should be fine.
In my Crown Vic, I had Jerry program the chip for a higher idle RPM but it never jumps THAT high during initial startup. Maybe 1500-1800 RPM tops from the sound of it, then it drops to about 900 RPM and stays there.
On the 2003 E-250 w/ the 5.4, it almost sounds like its stalling out when idling compared to the Vic! It idles at 700RPM or so and is totally stock. My Vic gets the same gas mileage and is louder than the E-250.
Anyhow, if it just hits 2500 and dies down then you shouldn't worry too much. It's probably just working the oil pump to shoot the engine oil up into the valvetrain area faster.
Remember to use a quality synthetic and you should be fine.
T
TripleTransAm
Guest
My MM was outdoors overnight, last run was yesterday afternoon. This afternoon I fired it up and paid close attention to the RPM.
Instant rev to 1800-1900, hangs there for about 5-10 seconds, then drops to 1500. If the A/C is on, the compressor then kicks in at that point, and RPM drops to maybe 1400.
Then it gradually settles on 1200. After a minute, it will drop to a cold-sounding 1000-1100.
Just for kicks, I revved it to 2500, just to see what it would sound like. Man, if my car fired up to 2500 on a startup, not only would I be surprised, I'd be asking questions. I know these are modern engines and all, but 2500 is pretty high for a startup. What's especially disturbing is all the talk of knocking at startup... yikes!
2500 sounds cool on startup, but not even old high-internal-friction V8s would rev that high on startup. In fact, most old 4 barrel carbed engines would end up activating the primary circuit on the carb if they tried to cold-idle at >2000 RPM, causing "nozzle drip" from the primary circuit which in turn would wash out the cylinder walls and increase wear. Now, this won't happen with an EFI engine, but all this to show that 2500 is pretty damned high for a startup.
Even 1900 is kind of high for an EFI V8, to be honest. My GTA, stone cold, will grab maybe 1200-1400, 1500 on rare occasions, and almost immediately settle to 1000 RPM. My WS6, after having sat all week, fired up this evening to a snarly 1300 RPM, then almost immediately dropped to 1000 RPM.
What do Mustang 4.6s do at startup?
Instant rev to 1800-1900, hangs there for about 5-10 seconds, then drops to 1500. If the A/C is on, the compressor then kicks in at that point, and RPM drops to maybe 1400.
Then it gradually settles on 1200. After a minute, it will drop to a cold-sounding 1000-1100.
Just for kicks, I revved it to 2500, just to see what it would sound like. Man, if my car fired up to 2500 on a startup, not only would I be surprised, I'd be asking questions. I know these are modern engines and all, but 2500 is pretty high for a startup. What's especially disturbing is all the talk of knocking at startup... yikes!
2500 sounds cool on startup, but not even old high-internal-friction V8s would rev that high on startup. In fact, most old 4 barrel carbed engines would end up activating the primary circuit on the carb if they tried to cold-idle at >2000 RPM, causing "nozzle drip" from the primary circuit which in turn would wash out the cylinder walls and increase wear. Now, this won't happen with an EFI engine, but all this to show that 2500 is pretty damned high for a startup.
Even 1900 is kind of high for an EFI V8, to be honest. My GTA, stone cold, will grab maybe 1200-1400, 1500 on rare occasions, and almost immediately settle to 1000 RPM. My WS6, after having sat all week, fired up this evening to a snarly 1300 RPM, then almost immediately dropped to 1000 RPM.
What do Mustang 4.6s do at startup?
B
Bacque
Guest
Hey , I am the new kid on the block and do appreciate all of your replys to my question.
Hope to meet some of you in Dallas in September.
Hope to meet some of you in Dallas in September.